COO guide for Snowtrooper: COO no. 1 is shared by Ledy and Kenner??


NOTE:
Ok, Ok , before you start flaming me , let me tell you that I am aware that Lili Ledy never produced the Snowtrooper figure. The only Hoth figure ever released by Lili Ledy was Rebel Commander. So why making an entry for Snowtrooper in a Ledy thread??? Let me try to explain:

Lately I have bought some Ledy figures from a friendly Mexican guy. He told me that all the figures originated from his childhood collection. They were all genuine Ledy and very minty (at least for Ledy ). Yes I was very happy with these figures. In addition he gave me some interesting background information for some of his figures, information which was very likely to be true based upon the feedback from some of our Mexican Ledy collectors here on TIG (thx Ozio and Carlos!). He told me for instance that his childhood green cape Luke Jedi came with Madine’s staff instead of a light saber. And in fact from what I understood there are more Mexicans remembering that their Luke Jedi came with a strange white light saber (see the pics in Luke Jedi's entry on page 7 of this thread).

The Mexican seller also told me that his blonde LL Luke Bespin came with Kenner instead of Ledy accessories. This was later confirmed. The blonde LL Luke Bespin was released in LL ROTJ cards during the earlier runs, 12 back and maybe 14 back. He has exactly the same COO as his PBP brother and came with Kenner accessories including a blue Han Solo blaster and a yellow PBP lightsaber. The brown hair Ledy Luke Bespin was released later on 30 back cards and came with Ledy accessories (blue Ledy Bespin gun and yellow Ledy saber).

So it seems that the background stories from this Mexican seller may seem odd at the beginning, but in the end they seem to be true.  Maybe this also applies for the next story:
When watching pics from his childhood collection I noticed a Snowtrooper. Lili Ledy never produced a Snowtrooper, so this seemed odd, and I mailed him:

"What about the Imperial Stormtrooper (Snowtrooper). He was never released by LL, was he?"
He answered: "Yes, but it was in the ESB wave. I'm not sure if those were made in Mexico or were recarded from the Kenner ones."

His answer almost stroke me down, could it be that this Snowtrooper was one of the few figures which were released on the early Empire Strikes Back (Imperio Contraataca) 10-backs? Around 1982 Lili Ledy did not produce any Star Wars figures but the company was interested to do so seeing the success of the 3 3/4” line abroad. To make a balanced decision, Lili Ledy first tested the potential of the local Mexican market, basically to get an idea to what extent Mexican kids would be appealed by Star wars figures and ask their parents to (re)buy them. Thereto ten Kenner figures were released on Ledy ESB cards, all showing the beautiful art work of a Millennium falcon being escorted by a squadron of X-Wing fighters. At the back of the card there were line drawings of the 10 figures which – typical for the later Leyy cards - were printed directly on the cardboard. I assume the market test was successful and Ledy started to produce their own figures from 1983 till 1985. You can read more about this subject on SWCA.


Lili Ledy ESB 10-back. Back. (Picture from SWCA)

[/center]

The Mexican seller remembered that his Snowtrooper was indeed pulled off from an Imperio Contraataca card, unfortunately he didn’t have the card anymore.   He let me have the figure for the (cheap!) price of a Kenner figure. Off course without the original card, this Snowtrooper was basically just a regular Kenner figure, only the background story made this figure so very interesting to me.  

Off course I don’t have any proof but what do you think guys: Could this indeed be a Kenner figure which was once released on a Lili Ledy 10-back ESB card. Maybe the COO stamp tells us something? Or is this story just to good to be true. A hoax set up by Dan to get his sweet revenge after I messed up with the black Wampa?
Tell me what you think about it pls


Ledy Snowtrooper?



Ledy Snowtrooper?


Ledy Snowtrooper?


Ledy Snowtrooper?


Ledy Snowtrooper?



EDIT: Summary based upon the next posts:

Dr Dengar wrote:

I agree, there is no way to prove that this Snowtrooper was once pulled from a Ledy Imperio Contraataca card. I fully rely on one Mexican source claiming he had this figure bought on such a card when he was a child. The source seems reliable based upon two other claims (presented in the previous post) which seemed unusual at first glance but seemed to be sound in the end. Besides the seller had no real motif to lie about this. In the end he let me have his snowtrooper for only a few $ - a normal price for a mint snowtrooper - which was peanuts compared to the total deal.  Off course still no solid evidence, merely a strong indication that this snowtrooper came from a Ledy card.

Let me summarize, I tend to belief the background story for this particular snowtrooper. Though he has a low price (once pulled from the card he became just a regular Kenner snowie), to me he has value for sure.

.... unless we believe Alejandro Becerra, LL Quality Control Director (1981 to 1985), the man to whom we own so much Ledy variations today

'The 10 figures from the ESB LL line where fully produced in Mexico, molds where imported from kenner's factories on Asia'

Nice work Marco, i'll like to add this:
There are two interviews with 2 LL ex-employess, and this is what they said about the 10 figures from the LL ESB line:

Alejandro Becerra, LL Quality Control Director (1981 to 1985)
'The 10 figures from the ESB LL line where fully produced in Mexico, molds where imported from kenner's factories on Asia'

Celia Flores Jimenez, LL Color line Supervisor (1966-1985)
'Nothing came from outside, we manufactured absolutely all, clothes, accesories, guns.


Magazine cover for Alejandro's interview

Alejandro's interview by Julio Moreno, Josefina and Luis Galvez


magazine cover for Celia's interview

Celia's interview by Luis Villagomez

More pics here:
https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.1824552449480.106540.1110304487&l=5b9f9f4d6a

According to this 2 Ex-Employees, the 10 figures from the LL ESB line (Luke Bespin, Snowtrooper, Rebel Commander, Han Hoth, Bespin Leia, Vader, Chewbacca, C3PO, R2D2 and Yoda) are 100% made in Mexico, So that Snowtrooper you have was probably made in Mexico m8.

Hope this info helps.

Great detective work Marco and a great story to go with your new snowtrooper. I never knew about the Ledy making the other 3 ESB figs. Great info mate, thanks for sharing.

I don't Know how common that COO is either, I've not come across one yet.

Thats an intresting story. Never seen that ESB card back before, its amazing looking.

I found some more information about the figures which were released on Ledy Imperio Contraataca cards in a RS thread from 2009. The information was provided by llseeker (Carlos) at that time.

The ESB LL figures were not produced in Mexico. They were regular Kenner figures on LL cards. I bought some of them in the childhood days. Never kept the cards, though.... kids....

Here are the figures and their features:

• Chewbacca
  
• Han hoth (pink face)
  
• Yoda (orange snake)
  
• C3PO (with rivet on back)
  
• R2D2 (with cross-head screw)

All are HK coo figs and there is nothing special about them variant-wise. Once out of the cards they are average figures. As far as I know, all 10 figures were released for a very short time, in fact some LL employees regard them as "test market" figures.

Finding one carded is just impossible. As far as I know, no one has ever found an original one carded.


Interesting...

Dr Dengar wrote:

I found some more information about the figures which were released on Ledy Imperio Contraataca cards in a RS thread from 2009. The information was provided by llseeker (Carlos) at that time.

The ESB LL figures were not produced in Mexico. They were regular Kenner figures on LL cards. I bought some of them in the childhood days. Never kept the cards, though.... kids....

Here are the figures and their features:

• Chewbacca
  
• Han hoth (pink face)
  
• Yoda (orange snake)
  
• C3PO (with rivet on back)
  
• R2D2 (with cross-head screw)

All are HK coo figs and there is nothing special about them variant-wise. Once out of the cards they are average figures. As far as I know, all 10 figures were released for a very short time, in fact some LL employees regard them as "test market" figures.

Finding one carded is just impossible. As far as I know, no one has ever found an original one carded.


Interesting...

Very interesting Marco and it makes sense as well.

I cant image what the price would end up at if a genuine Ledy Imperio Contraataca MOC turned up!

as long as people can make money they will tell you whatever you want to hear.......more I wont say to this issue...sorry guys!

Just: Common sense guys: no Mocs...no proof! I dont give a cent on peoples opinions on "rembering" their childhood! There is TONS of examples of childhood myths!!! And thats all...myths...some ridicoulus...some interesting...but at the end of the day: just myths!

That Snowtrooper is a common Snowtrooper BTW...you can find hundreds every day!

(I myself believe they just packed and painted their figures in ESB area! The unassembled figures camefrom spain! But thats also just a guess.....or a myth...as you like )

jaymassive619 wrote:

Dr Dengar wrote:

I found some more information about the figures which were released on Ledy Imperio Contraataca cards in a RS thread from 2009. The information was provided by llseeker (Carlos) at that time.

The ESB LL figures were not produced in Mexico. They were regular Kenner figures on LL cards. I bought some of them in the childhood days. Never kept the cards, though.... kids....

Here are the figures and their features:

• Chewbacca
  
• Han hoth (pink face)
  
• Yoda (orange snake)
  
• C3PO (with rivet on back)
  
• R2D2 (with cross-head screw)

All are HK coo figs and there is nothing special about them variant-wise. Once out of the cards they are average figures. As far as I know, all 10 figures were released for a very short time, in fact some LL employees regard them as "test market" figures.

Finding one carded is just impossible. As far as I know, no one has ever found an original one carded.


Interesting...

Very interesting Marco and it makes sense as well.

I cant image what the price would end up at if a genuine Ledy Imperio Contraataca MOC turned up!

I have seen 2 carded Ledy Imperio Contraataca MOC , SORRY , but I can`t tell if they are real or not ( even the LL experts doesn`t know if they are real or not because they say that the card was heavier than the ROTJ line , and that the bubble used was different also, adding that the glue for pasting the bubble to the card was better !!!), that would make sense , cause they were to expensive , so that is why they change everything so it was cheaper to produce them .

Owners claim that their action figures are the real thing, of course they won`t sell them at any price, during the last convention at Mexico city ( august 2010) , one of the owners told me that a Japanese collector was willing to pay him top dollars for that item, but he didn`t want to sell it!

Thanks for all the great pictures, just what I was needing

Thanks guys for sharing your thoughts about the Snowtrooper!

• @ Ozio: You provided a very nice wield of inside Ledy information with those Universo Star Wars issues. Luckily I had French in high school so I could at least understand 70% of what was written.
  
• @ Wolff: There is really no need to say sorry, I appreciate an independent and sometimes different opinion as it keep us sharp in this thread. That being said, next time pls halt die Klappe (kidding )
  
• @ Adolfo: Cool you have seen Ledy Imperio Contraataca MOCs with your own eyes. You mentioned that a Japanese collector was interested in having them. That probably must be the guy owning this huge LL collection.

I agree, there is no way to prove that this Snowtrooper was once pulled from a Ledy Imperio Contraataca card. I fully rely on one Mexican source claiming he had this figure bought on such a card when he was a child. The source seems reliable based upon two other claims (presented in the previous post) which seemed unusual at first glance but seemed to be sound in the end. Besides the seller had no real motif to lie about this. In the end he let me have his snowtrooper for only a few $ - a normal price for a mint snowtrooper - which was peanuts compared to the total deal. Off course still no solid evidence, merely a strong indication that this snowtrooper came from a Ledy card.

Let me summarize, I tend to belief the background story for this particular snowtrooper. Though he has a low price (once pulled from the card he became just a regular Kenner snowie), to me he has value for sure.

.... unless we believe Alejandro Becerra, LL Quality Control Director (1981 to 1985), the man to whom we own so much Ledy variations today

'The 10 figures from the ESB LL line where fully produced in Mexico, molds where imported from kenner's factories on Asia'

Hi Dr Dengar, can you make the same pictures with the YPS so we can see if we have an original YPS ?

Hi Lars,

I am glad to help you but I am not sure what you mean exactly. Would you like to see comparison pics between this Snowtrooper from Mexico and an YPS trooper?

I think an YPS trooper has a different COO (no. 10-17 in Wolf's scheme).

Dr Dengar wrote:

Hi Lars,

I am glad to help you but I am not sure what you mean exactly. Would you like to see comparison pics between this Snowtrooper from Mexico and an YPS trooper?

I think an YPS trooper has a different COO (no. 10-17 in Wolf's scheme).

No I want to see pictures of the YPS Trooper, only the YPS. I am a little bit confused about my own YPS.

And thanks again for all the help.

I can't make pics of my YPS trooper, I am abroad at the moment. But I found some info which might be usefull for you.

http://www.landoslocker.com/range_esb/hoth_stormtrooper.shtml

http://threads.rebelscum.com/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=UBB1&Number=2898854&Forum=f1&Words=%2Bsnowtrooper%20%2Btrilogo&Searchpage=0&Limit=25&Main=2898854&Search=true&where=sub&Name=&daterange=1&newerval=10&newertype=y&olderval=&oldertype=&bodyprev=#Post2898854

Hope it helps.

Now let's continue discussing Ledy stuff here.

COO guide for Gamorrean Guard: No. 4 is unique for Lili Ledy


NOTE:

• The Ledy Gamorrean Guard has an unique COO (no. 4). In the pics below a comparison is made with a Kenner Gam Guard having COO no. 5.
  

Gamorrean Guard: Lili Ledy on the right


Gamorrean Guard: Lili Ledy on the right


Gamorrean Guard: Lili Ledy on the right


Gamorrean Guard: Lili Ledy on the right


Gamorrean Guard: Lili Ledy on the right


Gamorrean Guard: Lili Ledy on the right



DIFFERENCES:
Compared to his Kenner (no COO) counterpart, the Ledy Gamorrean Guard has:
- helmet with a brown instead of silver tip at the front (close to the forehead)
- bright yellow instead of pale yellow horns, eyes, and teeth
- a darker green skin (arms, legs, face): keep in mind however that some Kenner Gam Guards can also have a darker green skin, see the ‘family picture’ below
- a darker grey armour (same remark)
- darker brown cloths
- an unique COO (COO no. 4)

The Gamorrean Clan



ACCESSORIES
The Ledy Gamorrean Guard carries an axe having a shaft which is shorter and much more detailed compared to a Kenner axe. The shaft of the Ledy axe can be brown and dark brown.

Marco your a ledy machine.
I'm on a LL rollercoaster ride and i don't want the ride to end.

Those Ledy axes are alot more nicer and detailed looking then the Kenner version.

Which axes are molded in brown or silver plastic?

aussiejames wrote:

Which axes are molded in brown or silver plastic?

From the close up pics it appears that the V3 and V4 (=Ledy) mould axes were both molded in brown plastic (silver paint applied).

I don't know about the V1 and V2 moulds. Anyone?

Awesome work on the Gamorrean Guard Marco

As Marco highlighted this thread is an opotunity for the community to discuss the Ledy Figures and ensure that we create together the best quality Lili Ledy Guide possible Once information has been confirmed it is then built into the TIG Lili Ledy Guide located in the TIG Interactive section.

Here is a link to the Ledy Guide Homepage - http://www.imperialgunneryforum.com/TIG-Ledy-Guide-Homepage-h8.htm

Theres still lots of Lili Ledy Figures in this thread that need discussion so the more people that get involved the better

Jay

COO guide for Chief Chirpa: No. 6 is unique for Lili Ledy


NOTE:

• The Ledy Chief Chirpa has an unique COO (no. 6). In the pics below a comparison is made with a Kenner Chirpa having COO no. 2.
  

Chief Chirpa: Lili Ledy on the right


Chief Chirpa: Lili Ledy on the right


Chief Chirpa: Lili Ledy on the right


Chief Chirpa: Lili Ledy on the right


Chief Chirpa: Lili Ledy on the right


Chief Chirpa: Lili Ledy on the right


Chief Chirpa: Lili Ledy on the right


Chief Chirpa: Lili Ledy on the right


Chief Chirpa: Lili Ledy on the right



DIFFERENCES:
Compared to his Kenner ("H.K.") counterpart, the Ledy Chief Chirpa has:

- a differently sculpted amulet (see pic below)
- an unique COO (COO no. 6).





ACCESSORIES

• The Ledy Chief Chirpa carries a brown staff with a little "L".
  
  
  
  
• The Ledy Chief Chirpa carries a brown hood which is a shade darker compared to the Kenner hood. Inside there is a big mould circle.
  
  
  
  

LEDY VARIATIONS
Due to Lili Ledy’s inconsistent quality control small variations of the Ledy Chirpa may exist, as is the case for many other Ledy figures. Below is an example of two Ledy Chief Chirpas having different eye sizes.

Lili Ledy Chirpas having different eye sizes


Lili Ledy Chirpas having different eye sizes

oOh snap, turns out I have a Ledy Chirpa without a weapon. Score one for the good guys.

Yr1977 wrote:

oOh snap, turns out I have a Ledy Chirpa without a weapon. Score one for the good guys.

Congrats on the loose Ledy Chirpa and good luck hunting the staff.
Is the hood Ledy?

Dr Dengar wrote:

Yr1977 wrote:

oOh snap, turns out I have a Ledy Chirpa without a weapon. Score one for the good guys.

Congrats on the loose Ledy Chirpa and good luck hunting the staff.
Is the hood Ledy?

Yea, the hood too. Im kicking myself though cos i hade a black staff but that I though was a repo,may have sold it!! Gonna have a hunt and try find it. Hope ive still got it.

In a RebelScum post from 2001, Todd Chamberlain wrote:

These would be my assessments of "value" as it were of the major variations in near mint condition:

• Red Cape Squid $100
  
• Burghundy cape Bib $100
  
• Rough cape Han Trench $80
  
• Cloud Car Pilot (bright yellow gloves and boots) $50+ if really nice. the paint on these is really poor and I haven't seen one better than low c8. It's one of the rarest carded ledy's.
  
• Emperor with Chief Chirpa cane $45
  
• Klaatu with hair apron $25
  
• Stormtrooper (different plastic, sharper detail) $25-30

Some of these prices reflect actual sales (Bib, Squid) while others are just guesses based on how hard I've found a piece to be to find. There are several other figures with noticeable paint and weapon differences that I'd guess might sell for $15-25.

I thought about sharing this: While digging through the archives of RebelScum, I encountered this list of prices for Ledy figures posted back in 2001. Ten years later, the demand for Lili Ledy figures has increased a lot apparently, resulting in prices which are tripled, quadrupled, or even more. Click here for the RSthread.

Time to invest in a time machine to save some serious cash.