Tried posting this on RS and it turned into a grammar lesson.

At the time I was looking for a loose Ledy RRBF that there was a rumor of a discovery made of a carded RRBF.

It was explained to me by someone who knew about Ledy's that the positioning of the rocket in the pack is how the difference between a fixed and removable rocket is determined on an MOC example. It was the only known example.

Does anyone know if one since surfaced or has been graded by AFA?

UPDATE: Since posting this earlier on RS, I heard back from CIB that they haven't authenticated one.

You beat me it to it Joe.

Far as I know there isn't any either. I mean considering it's really just a result of poor welding (or no welding) a person should be able to just see the rocket floating in the bubble or dancing around when you shake the figure in the bubble. Granted I wouldn't want to do that with a Ledy MOC LOL

Thanks John!

Here is a video of my RR BF before I sent it in for grading.




If you notice, the rocket needs to go in with a tab position that will allow it to enter into the backpack. There is also at around the 7 second mark a clicking sound that determines the rockets proper seating in the pack. From what I understand, the RR BF missiles were factory seated so while it's possible for one to come loose from mishandling or shaking, from what I was told, the position of the rocket to allow the rockets tab to slide in the pack differs from the position of the fixed rocket. On this last point, this is what I was told and just want to find out from anyone here if they know this to be true or not.

Anyhow, I asked around before buying from this seller, and everything I heard about him was he had a rock solid rep. I just wondered if the rumoured example he was telling me about ever made it market or if anyone ended-up with it.

Sorry to be so vague about the seller, but I intend to follow-up with them some time soon on this and just wanted to know if anyone knew any differently.

BTW: I love the video embed functionality - thanks John!

finestcomics wrote:

Tried posting this on RS and it turned into a grammar lesson.

So you mean, TIG is second choice?

Kidding aside, in Steve's threads below, you wil find some good info on RR Fetts.

Non welded rocket (the correct version) and wrongly welded rocket (a factory error, which AFA will not grade):

http://www.imperialgunneryforum.com/t4086-my-lili-ledy-fetts-rr-regular-and-factory-error


http://www.imperialgunneryforum.com/t3605-my-new-lili-ledy-removable-rocket-boba-fett


Hope this helps.



Cheers

Thanks Dr Dengar. I'm all set on loose examples. What I'm really looking at is MOC examples, specifically to verify what I was told about the positioning of the rocket being different on a RR BF and a FR BF.

Interesting subject. Joe, I would take into account the numbers of RR LL Fetts (loose) out there. 50 or less... So, to find a MOC is pretty crazy rare, making me think if it's real, it may be a one of a kind.
Now lets get back to the threads that Marco provided. They actually may help you if you read them. That MOC you heard about may actually be a Ledy Fett that had it's rocket inserted incorrectly, sonic welded, and then it came loose. The tab on the rocket would be angled towards the front of the chest, not the backpack. A small sonic weld line on near the edge of the tab would be evidence if it is just a factory error or not. On a REGULAR LL Fett that has been sonic welded correctly, the sonic weld line is on the opposite side of the tab on the rocket. This would NOT be a true RR LL Fett MOC then. If it was a true RR LL Fett, the rocket would have been inserted by hand after sonic welding then came loose in the bubble, with absolutely NO signs of sonic welding. So if it is true, what you heard, it could be either. And if it is indeed a true RR LL Fett, how can anyone say how the rocket was indeed inserted in the back, unless you were the worker doing this. I've handled one, and understand the clicking motion. If it was clicked in place, I don't see it falling out.... But who knows.... I just don't think there is any obvious was to distinguish how it was inserted to differ it from a real RR LL Fett and a factory error LL Fett unless the rocket is clean of any sonic weld lines and is just floating around in the bubble. You should ask Ozio, or Luis or Christian.... They know a lot more then me. My opinion is based on owning the loose figures, not a MOC figure.
-Steve
ps- Also just a thought, but if someone is saying they can tell on a MOC that the rocket was inserted differently then a normal LL Fett and they are calling it a RR Fett, I think they are jumping the gun. If that rocket is not floating around, how would that individual know if there is sonic weld markings on the rocket. Again, if its not floating around the bubble I don't think they could clearly make that statement... I guess this whole thread confuses me the more I think about it...

Thanks Steve.

So the main intent of me posting was to see if anyone heard of anything like what I've said about the position of the rocket being different from an RR BF and a FR BF.

I fully understand the rarity of the figure makes it a difficult and complicated question to ask, but if no one does know, then the next best thing would be to see if someone is able to produce some photos of an RR BF from a profile view with the rocket seated inside the pack.

My RR BF is AFA'd, and of course you know they place the rocket in its own miniature case inside the figure case, and not in the rocket pack.

What I'm trying to do is see if there's difference in the way the rocket sits once it's seated in an RR BF.

I'm mostly looking at the way the 8 pockets (of which only 4 are visible once the rocket is inside the pack) line-up when compared to the fixed rocket version.

More specifically, from the following photo, you can see the way the rocket needs to be inserted on a slight angle to allow the tab to negotiate the opening and enter the pack:



The angle the photo is taken, it makes it difficult to see how the seam separating the 8 pockets on the sides of the rocket lines-up. If the rocket were completely seated, and the image was taken from profile view, zoomed right into the rocket to see the seam, that would be something I could work with as I would then reproduce the same photo using my fixed rocket (I have one AFA'd, but also one that's ungraded).

Again, I have no reason to doubt the individual who told me this, especially since he produced a fantastic RR BF that was authenticated by AFA/CIB. If the seam separating the 8 pocketed/sided rocket is even slightly off-angle because of the way the tab of the RR BF needs to enter the rocket pack, then I know whether what this seller was telling me is even possible.

So to clear up any confusion, I just wanted to be somewhat prepared going into discussion about a potential MOC. Given the rarity of the figure and the issue of not being able to photograph mine the way I'd like, I am seeking help from anyone here who may know more about this or even can provide some angle photos (one close-up profile shot where the rocket can be seen coming out from the pack) of a RR BF to compare with a fixed rocket Ledy Fett

But again, the tab is inserted forward towards the chest, as seen in your picture, on both the RR LL Fett and Factory Error LL Fett. The only difference is the factory error version has sonic weld lines next to the tab and the true RR LL Fett has no sonic weld lines at all. With that being said, both had the rockets inserted the same, but the factory error before sonic welding and the true RR LL Fett after. So unless that rocket falls out in the bubble for you to see whether it has any sonic weld line or not (next to the tab) I think it would be impossible for that seller to tell the difference. The picture you provided is 100% proof of that. It has a sonic weld line next to the tab. The reason I know this is because I once owned it. The only way you could tell is if the rocket slides up and down for you to see the tab...
I just can't see how this person could clearly state because the tab is pointing towards the chest, it is 100% a RR LL Fett. The picture above speaks for itself!
-Steve

Perfect Steve. This is exactly what I was thinking especially after seeing the links Dr Dengar provided, so I'm glad I asked and was able to clarify from at least two other sources (you and John).

So to be 100% clear, both the factory error and the fixed rocket would have the sonic weld line/marks?

Too bad plastic doesn't show-up on an x-ray.

Correct Joe, they would both have sonic weld line BUT not in the same place. A REGULAR Lili Ledy Fett, like other production Fetts would have the tab on the rocket facing the back pack. The sonic weld line would be on the opposite side of the tab on the rocket. Where as on a factor error Lili Ledy Fett, the tab was positioned incorrectly facing forward at a slight angle (towards the chest, just like seen in the picture above). The sonic weld line would then run along the side of the tab on the rocket.
Does that help?

Makes sense to me.

Do you know if AFA would treat the factory error as a forcibly removed rocket?

I'm pretty positive if the rocket was removed and had any signs of sonic welding it would be rejected for grading... Not sure if that falls under the "forcibly removing" category but it would be rejected. I've seen a handful of these factory errors now and the ones that were submitted to AFA were all rejected.