Guys I never thought I would need to do this but I feel totally scammed at the moment by ebay seller "- www_lostyourtoys_com" and hoping some folks can help me out if they have time?

I am I over reacting though? And should I just leave this be and put it down to a bad apple experience?

Here’s my grief...

I won this Canadian Jabba Playset last week on eBay:


Actual Link:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=400133165632&ssPageName=ADME:X:AAQ:US:1123



As can be seen in the seller’s pictures everything is there. The Seller also states in his description that:

This is an Original Star Wars ROTJ Jabba the Hutt Playset Kenner Canada version MIB C9 Toy is mint, complete, unused... Winner pays cost for shipping...

He even points out a rather unique ding in one of the box’s panels (see the picture of Luke being “whacked” by Jabba). I thought at the time this was quite considerate of the seller to point this out, but it turns out to be a crucial factor in my complaint.


I ended up winning the auction as the only bidder and paid in full shortly after. The Jabba Playset arrived yesterday by USPS. My problems started when I opened the package. The Playset had been jammed into a shipping box which was smaller than the actual Playset so it got squashed during packing. Here are some shots of the box you can see crush marks on the box where it was damaged during packing:








This obviously is disappointing but some sellers are inconsiderate "packers". It wasn’t until I opened the Playset that I really got pissed off. When I opened the contents I found that the seller had taken the original Canadian Kenner Catalogue from the package. This is what I actually received:




My complaint is that everything is there except the Kenner Canada Mini Catalogue. In my opinion this is a rare version and the Canadian dual language catalogue is a key component of this Playset which make it different to the USA version.

I strongly believe the Seller has deliberately taken out the most valuable item within the Playset because I won it at the initial starting price and he didn’t get what he wanted for it. This shouldn’t be my fault. I feel that his begrudging attitude to packing my Playset and taking out key items to “compensate” himself for not getting a higher price is disgraceful.

I have written to the seller and was told:
“Sorry, Have 2 of these Playsets thought both were the same. Either except $10 or return the Playset”

This has upset me further ... why should I pay to return the Jabba Playset just to get my original money back? Sending something large from Ireland back to the USA is going to be expensive. I reckon after converting the posting price in Euros to $ it will cost just as much as the price I originally paid for the Playset. As you all know I collect because I love star wars not for profit. I wanted the complete set for my Luke Jedi Focus and TIG Luke Jedi guide and now feel frustrated I can’t do that.


I also have no idea how much it would cost to replace the Dual Language Kenner mini-catalogue... but I am sure it going more than $10 I have been told to take. And what is the chance of someone being able to sell me their spare?


I also don’t believe his story about having two Identical Canadian Playsets and him accidently not knowing one had no Catalogue inside. If this is the case and he did accidently sent me another Canadian Playset without knowing it was incomplete, how come I have exactly the same Playset show in his auction in my possession now? Remember the give-away ding on the box as shown in the auction? Here is the same identical ding again on the Playset in my possession.








This is the same Playset that was shown in the auction and I believe he has taken (technically stolen) the original mini-catalogue out of the box just before sending.


Sorry Lads for moaning... I just feel really cheated at the moment. But I am genuinely upset and was wandering what my options are as he is under the impression I will have to pay the cost for returning the packages and told me to file a dispute against him. That takes some balls to blatantly mock me through eBay’s messaging system. So does he know something I don’t? Will eBay side with him?
At the moment I feel just like giving him a massive Negative to warn others, cut my losses, and put out a WTB for the missing Catalogue. How much would one of these cost me to replace?

Craigy T


Here's the ebay messages passed between us so far:

** me to him ***



Dear www_lostyourtoys_com,

I have received my item
However I can't leave you feedback yet, as some of the contents are missing. I bided on your item because your auction clearly stated that everything was original, unused and complete. In your auction you clearly show the full contents and within the photo is an original full colour Canadian ROTJ Jedi Mini Catalogue. This is unique to the Canadian release and so is an important part of the playset. I would not have bided on this auction if this catalogue was missing.
I would like the original full colour Canadian Mini Catalogue (the exact one shown in the auction) sent on to me please or I will have to open a refund dispute in PayPal/EBay. I do not wish our transaction to turn sour so if you can reply to me and let me and eBay know you will be sending on the missing catalogue that would be great.
I will end the dispute as soon as I received the catalogue and I will leave positive feedback for you.

Regard, Craig

*** His first reply ***



Sorry, I had two of these and I thought they were the same. I will not have a catalog to send you, so either accept a $10 refund for the missing catalog or return the set for a refund...


- www_lostyourtoys_com


*** My Reply ***

Dear www_lostyourtoys_com,

George,
Thank you for your reply.
I find it difficult to believe that this is a different Playset to the one advertised. The Box and contents are exactly the same as the Playset shown in the auction. This is right down to the actual box which has the same dents and scuffs in exactly the same places.
The cost to replace the Catalogue for this Playset will be much more than the $10 you have offered and I will not accept $10.
If you want to refund my money in full then that is your choice but please note shipping the item back to you will be charged to you as this is your mistake not mine. If this is the road you want to go down and I will then execute a crawl back on my payment with Paypal.

If you can recheck all your ?other? Canadian Boxes to see if the Catalogue has accidently ended up there then I would appreciate that. All I really want at the end of the day is the original Canadian Catalog that came with this set as shown in the picture and not any grief.

Craig


*** His second reply ***


File a dispute and let Ebay decide on the shipping


- www_lostyourtoys_com

What an ass wipe!!!!

I'm sure Ebay will find in your favor.... as what he sent you was not was described in the listing and photos!!!

You have every right to be pissed off. It is a pet hate of mine that buyers are responsible for return shipping ( & you must pay registered postage) & yes this will cost lots. Did you pay via credit card ? If so just reverse the payment. Paypal/ebay hate it when you do this but fuckem. His feedback is not perfect- neg the fucker. File item is not as described (incomplete & damaged). I feel your pain. You didn't even complain to him about the shite packaging.

Hi Craig

The guy is a scamming c***. He knew exactly what he was doing.

The fact that he is not willing to post you the booklet sums up his intention/s.

Why do these assholes have to trade in our (or any) hobby.

I hope you can take him via the PP route and make sure you leave him
a heavily worded neg.

Craigy hi, yeh you have every reason to feel pissed off mate - you purchased an item that was missing a component
that had been clearly advertised!

It's a chore to have to enter disputes and claims but maybe this is your best option.

Andy (Geordie) recently had a resolved claim in his favour by persisting with different managers of PayPal. Took him ages
but he won. He might chime in with some good advice.

Hope you get some satisfaction mate. Ebay is just a minefield of scamming arseholes lately.

Sorry to hear that Craig!

I would open a SNAD dispute against him as he has blatantly kept the catalogue even though it was pictured in the original listing.

Hope you get it sorted mate & kept all the messages from him in case paypal want to see them!

Definitely a seller to avoid if he pulls these sort of shenanigans!

Mark.

I bought my MIB Sandcrawler, MIB Palitoy Landspeeder and MISB Imperial Cruiser from this guy. I can't bear to think about what would have happened if he had done such a lousy packing job on that lot. So I'm counting my blessings a bit here if you don't mind Craig.

Really sorry to hear about your problems buddy. I think you're fully within your rights here. It really sucks when stuff that should be there isn't. Believe me, I know. No solution will be really satisfactory here.

Sounds a nightmare Craig!

Normally paypal will make you eat the return costs on a claim unless you phone speak to a manager and present your case.

If your not getting anywhere then let the manager know a charge back could be on its way as you feel you have no other option and they'll make the seller eat the return postage especially if there is specific proof showing they are at fault.

Now if you wanted to fuck him you could -

Take the 10$ refund then neg him followed by a credit card charge back to fuck both ebay, paypal and this twat (paypal passes the charge back onto the seller by putting his a/c in a neg balance or if he has funds on the a/c they take it straight off!

Or

This EXACT same thing happened to me,

I registered a complaint with paypal and required a PARTIAL refund on my purchase, if paypal rule in your favour then you get a parttial refund and get to keep the item.

Or just do a chargeback and send him an email stating if he wants it back then he must either collect it in person or pay for the trackable shipping back to the US.

then leave him a negative after it all.

Andy

Craigy,

sorry to hear about the scam mate,

ive just finished a 6 month night mare through paypal, they side with the buyer mate, however i do think you are (wrongly) liable for return shipping and you must !!! get recorded/signed for delivery otherwise he can claim to never have received it back

i would ring up and bypass the numpty who will answer the phone and ask to speak to a manager straight away ( all the ones i got through to where irish ) and explain what has happened and you should not be liable for postage, oh and copy/paste all the emails from him to them as part of the dispute

If you cant get no joy then maybe try the charge back route as mentioned by some of the other lads? its a balancing act between what it will cost to get the catalogue against what it will cost to send it back, i would def leave neg feedback for the prick

other than that its selling it on ( here maybe? ) to try get money back without having to spend postage , and putting funds towars a complete set???

its shit mate and you have my sympathy

good luck and keep us informed


Andy

Keep us updated!!!!!!

Gents:

I just finished the last shift of a long working week so just catching up with all your kind words. I appreciate it all! Really!
Thank you all for helping and giving your advice!

It is nice to have a few bros. standing by me.

The seller is obviously a big shark with a big intimidating feedback record that doesn't care about the hobby or the small guys like me. I know if it was me I would definitely not scammed anyone out of their money and made dam sure I protect what is a rare piece of star wars history by sending it suitably protected.


I think the best thing for me to do is to appeal to eBay and present the same evidence I have shown to you.

To send the item back across the Pond within a decent box and more padding than he ever gave me is going to cost more than I paid for Jabba in the first place – especially with a secured registered delivery service.

I will there try to get a partial refund on my item. I think $50 is a fair price considering it is going cost well above that to obtain a highly rare Canadian Catalogue as a spare part and have it shipped to me. Additionally, some of the $50 would also go towards his selfish packing Job and damaging a rare Playset.

EDIT - UPDATE 16/07/2010:

Wheels are in motion... I will post all updates below for future reference on ebay's dealings with my claim. Hopefully everything will workout fine.


Thanks guys!

Craigy T

coachk28 wrote:

Keep us updated!!!!!!

Cheers buddy!

This morning I wrote this response and sent it as a part of my official dispute... Ebay await the seller response ... I have reference this great site and directed both Ebay and the Seller to the this post.

For people who might have to use this method it wasn't that bad in the end. I spent most of my time looking for the page to start off the claim in the end I just used google. Here it is for future reference:

Start A Dispute on Ebay

Once you get there it pretty easy... you select the item your not happy with and start a logging you details. You are then asked to provide detail. I took everyones advice and wrote downn everything.

Here's my claim:

Hi welshboy_craig,

We're sorry there's a problem with your purchase.

Most eBay sellers work hard to provide exceptional customer service and try to make things right when something goes wrong. We encourage you to contact your seller in the Resolution Center, if you haven't already.

If you're not able to work it out, we're here to help. We've received your information, and we'll contact the seller about your issue and get back to you by Jul 23, 2010

If you're able to work things out with the seller, please close this case in the Resolution Center.

Details you've provided:
Problem: The item is not as described
You tried contacting the seller
You paid on Jul 08, 2010
You contacted the seller through eBay Messages
The item has missing parts or pieces
The seller has responded to you
The seller isn't working with you to solve the problem
You entered the phone number of ""
We will not share your phone number with the seller.

Additional information:

"Two attempts by me have been made to resolve this issue with the seller and both have failed and I have been left feeling cheated. His response in his emails is false and the attitude heartless. I am now appealing for assistance regarding a very rare 1983 Star Wars Jabba Playset I have bought from this seller.

This is a rare edition Dual language box that was released only in Canada. It comes with a unique Dual language catalogue inside. It is the catalogue that makes this set unique and why I bidded in the first place. Most people who would have had this Canadian Jabba Playset as a child in the 80s would have lost the catalogue many years ago. This makes the catalogue the most important piece of the toy for collectors.

I have been mislead into the buying this item from this person as they have described it in their auction as fully complete and original with all the paperwork inside. If you look at the auction you can see the picture of the item with all its contents on display including the rare colourful catalogue. Note also the additional photo showing the box has been damaged with a unique shaped dent in the box. This dent will prove I have been given exactly the same Playset photographed.

My problems started when I received my package and opened it: The Jabba playset Box had been squashed into a smaller shipping container which has crushed it. When I opened the Playest?s Box to check if the contents were OK, I found that the seller had taken the valuable dual language catalogue inside. I have received exactly the same Playset as shown in the auction. It has exactly the same dent that the seller points out in his auction. He has therefore removed the valuable catalogue prior to posting. Because of the rarity it I estimate it will cost me at least $40 including shipping to replace this.

I would like to claim $10.00 for him damaging the box during shipping. I have posted my complaint in the ?watch out ?section of the Imperial Gunnery Forum. This is a worldwide forum for Vintage Star Wars collectors. As you can see from the response I am not over-reacting.

Please see the pictures I have posted as evidence. Because of the size of the toy, sending the Playset back to the seller will cost me more than I paid in the first place.

I do not have these funds to pay and return the item to the USA and I run the risk of the seller lying again. His attitude and offer of $10 compensation in total is also unacceptable.

At the end of the day all I wanted was the missing catalogue sent to me and I would ignored the selfish way he packed my item.

I would like therefore to claim $50 compensation. I appreciate you might not be fully familiar with Vintage Star Wars, so here is further Information on my case and copies of all messages:

http://www.imperialgunneryforum.com/watch-out-section-f7/i-am-overreacting-here-or-is-the-ebay-seller-taking-the-pi-out-of-me-t1414.htm#26137"

You asked for: "Partail Refund of $50"

Craig you are being very reasonable, lets hope common sense prevails. Most good sellers pay for return postage if it is their mistake. You certainly did nothing wrong & should NOT loose out.

Thanks Aussie!

The Seller has replied here is his first response:


Hi welshboy_craig,
We let the seller know the item wasn't as described. The seller offered you a partial refund of $10.00.

You can go to the Resolution Center to accept this offer. The seller will have 3 days to issue the refund. If you accept the offer, the case will be closed and you won't be eligible for an additional refund.

If you don't want to accept the seller's offer or if you have more questions, you can send the seller a message in the Resolution Center. If you no longer want to communicate with the seller, you can contact eBay Customer Support to review this case and make a final decision.

Refund information:
The seller offered a partial refund of $10.00.

Seller's note:
"This is for a replacement for the supposed missing catalog. Any damages during shipping should be claimed with post office."

You can view the details of this case in the Resolution Center.


20 minutes later whilst I was escalating my case the Seller has embelshed his is his first response with more:

Hi welshboy_craig,
We let the seller know the item wasn't as described. The seller offered you a partial refund of $10.00.

You can go to the Resolution Center to accept this offer. The seller will have 3 days to issue the refund. If you accept the offer, the case will be closed and you won't be eligible for an additional refund.

If you don't want to accept the seller's offer or if you have more questions, you can send the seller a message in the Resolution Center. If you no longer want to communicate with the seller, you can contact eBay Customer Support to review this case and make a final decision.

Refund information:
The seller offered a partial refund of $10.00.

Seller's note:

"Of coarse the buyer over states the issue. The item in question here is a paper catalog. The catalog is not as rare as the buyer suggest, it came in every different type of Star Wars toy in the Kenner Canada toy line that year so finding a replacement should not be that hard to do. I also offered a $10 refund to cover the cost to replace the catalog, which is more then generous for a paper catalog. If the catalog was missing, I told him I was not aware of it and would be a mistake if it was missing, did not check it before I mailed the toy. Also the buyer claims there was damage to the box in shipping. In my listing, I clearly showed a hole and clearly described that there was a hole. If there was any other damage during shipping then the buyer did not inform me of it and should file a claim with the post office. I also informed the buyer that if he want to return the toy for a full refund I would not cover the return postage. "


You can view the details of this case in the Resolution Center.

Star Wars ROTJ Jabba Hutt Playset Canada MIB C9
Item # :400133165632
Sale price:$99.99
Quantity:1
Sale date:Jul-08-10 08:27:11 PDT
Seller:www_lostyourtoys_com
Case #:5003140809
Case opened:Jul-16-10 05:08:02 PDT


This is my reply:

You have escalated the case to eBay Customer Support.

Your message to eBay Customer Support:

"Offer by Seller is of $10 is totally disproportionate and unfair.

I have sought expert opinion from independent collectors on an International Vintage Star Wars Toy Collector’s Forum and my claim is not over the top.

Please see the Forum replies to my post for yourselves:

http://www.imperialgunneryforum.com/watch-out-section-f7/i-am-overreacting-here-or-is-the-ebay-seller-taking-the-pi-out-of-me-t1414.htm

The seller can just send me the catalogue he has stolen from my Toy if he doesn't want to pay the cost of replacing it.

All I want at the end of the day is the complete Playset that I paid for!

I must point out USPS didn’t damage my item. I said the Seller squashed it in to a shipping container that was smaller than the actual Toy's box which is why the Toy’s packaging got crushed. Again see my posted photo’s to compare depths. Even if USPS tip-toed the package to me The Playset inside would have arrived squashed as seen. I trust Ebay to decide wisely.

Craig."

Please give us 72 hours to review the information you provided and come back with our final decision via email and the Resolution Center. Depending on the case details, we may need more time but will try our hardest not to keep you waiting for more than 72 hours.


So that is it 72 hours and I will know if I will get any more money back after being sammed

pm on its way

I guess he does not realize Ebay can read all the emails between the two of you that were made in their system. His story does not match what he stated in the emails, as he admits he did not send the catalog (and still has it because he has another jabba set). In the resolution center he is implying the "Supposed " missing catalog infering that your lying. What a loser.

Tiefighterboy wrote:

I guess he does not realize Ebay can read all the emails between the two of you that were made in their system. His story does not match what he stated in the emails, as he admits he did not send the catalog (and still has it because he has another jabba set). In the resolution center he is implying the "Supposed " missing catalog infering that your lying. What a loser.

I agree Todd is there anyway you can highlight that to eBay Craig?

Cheers Jay

Hi Craig

The guy is just digging himself a deeper hole.

He makes out that he didn't check to see if the catalogue
was in the package, he then makes out that it isn't rare
and yet won't post it to you

HE IS A FIRST CLASS SCAMMER.

I really hope you come out of this with the refund you are asking
for. You are patient and articulate in your wording of the claim
through ebay.

Good luck..

Ebay carnt access messages between people on Ebay, If you make referance to it they request a copy of the email including full headder sending to them, I had big argument over those fake weapons i bought last month and he admitted in his message that they had not been sent on 6.30 friday night but another message at 8.30 saturday morning he claimed to have sent them. I had to forward on the emails you get with the details on for them to be able to read it.

I have been brought up to always try & do the right thing- but it's times like this that I'd be tempted to send the seller a boxed lump of wood & give ebay the tracking number

I just noticed you left him a negative With him dropping below 98% that closes the door on alot of options of upgrading his account ect and will take considerable effort to recover to a 'trustable' position on ebay, i know its not a lot of compensation but its what he deserved

P.S. ive added the catalogue to my daily searches

Thanks Lee!

I appreciate the help in searching.